Gainsborough Trinity at home

[mrsann]

So is someone going to say why Chippendale is out of favour and how long they think he'll be prepared to sit on the bench.

[bigj]

Couldn't string two passes together today against a Gainsboro side who were doing just that in the first half. Thought Callum Murphy should have been on much earlier as we looked more dangerous with his presence. In the same vein Callum Chippendale should have been on for an out-of-sorts Liam Tomgue as he offers a different and skillful outlet in a struggling midfield.

[tugger18]

Thought we played the wrong type of game today. Our number 11 was the most dangerous player on the pitch but we chose to ignore him. Denton played his best game when he came on as sub against Basford. No midfield today we got over run by Gainsborough. Ashman is never a right back. Get Murphy and Whelan back in the team. We are playing with ten men at the minute.
Onwards and upwards.

[rawdonlion]

Didn’t attend the ‘meet the manager’ but in the opening weeks of Welsh appointment it was claimed he involved the community and supporters alike. I don’t really know the guy but not seen any of that myself. Doesn’t engage with fans in the clubhouse from what I’ve seen. I was thinking he might have done more to speak to the fans unless I’ve missed something

[netherfieldlion]

We’ve got rid of a coach and goalkeeper coach and appointed a goalkeeper coach in recent weeks … and gone backwards. Ollie Battersby has made more mistakes in the last few games than he had all season.

Pratt and Chippendale and the two Irish lads have been marginalised and we’ve got worse as a result.

Confused.com

[MrP]

Another disappointing home performance.
It’s fair to say Nethermoor is no fortress at present.
I think some of the disappointment comes from the fact we’ve been given a big slice of luck (if Marske’s results are expunged) and we have taken advantage and like Boxing Day, there was another decent crowd and the neutrals amongst them may wonder what all the fuss is about.
As to the game, a very limp first half, another missed penalty and then of course the late sucker-punch.
The penalty miss was costly. Score that and it’s hard to see us lose as G’boro didn’t offer a great deal. Stood behind the goal, it was obvious Dents was going to his right, he never looked confident and there you have it.
Otherwise…
We missed Brown.
Gabs was doing the running of 2 players
I suspect 4-3-3 would be better with the players we have available
Some of the players not being used need to be moved on if we aren’t going to play them.
And…
The Board has a decision to make. We are right in the mix (with the loos of Marske). Do you invest now and aim for promotion or do you hold fire, hope for a play-off spot and try again next year

[ivor]

Jan 6, 2024 22:56:11 GMT 1 rawdonlion said:

Didn’t attend the ‘meet the manager’ but in the opening weeks of Welsh appointment it was claimed he involved the community and supporters alike. I don’t really know the guy but not seen any of that myself. Doesn’t engage with fans in the clubhouse from what I’ve seen. I was thinking he might have done more to speak to the fans unless I’ve missed something

I think you have missed something. I have often seen him engage with individual supporters in the bar and he did yesterday. He is entitled also to sit down with his team or family. A manager will always be criticised after poor performances but let's be reasonable

[plasticman]

The least said about yesterday's seizure of defeat from the jaws of a turgid draw, the better. Some might think the performance on Saturday was one of the worst for years. In my almost complete attendance of home league games over the last 7 years, I've seen worse. A lot worse. In fact I haven't seen very much to cheer about in that time. I think the difference this season is that we'd started to become unaccustomedly a bit spoiled by the overall reasonably good standard since the departure of Paul Phillips at the end of September. Initially we were completely spoiled by the success under the temporary management of Liam Tongue. Since the arrival of Mr Welsh in late September, it's been a bit of a mixed bag at best.

I don't mean to level personal cticisims, but rather to question what "management" means in football. Managers and players alike in the lower leagues are on roundabouts, regularly arriving and departing various destinations, often for very short periods. When a new manager arrives, unlike most other workplaces in life, there is typically a clear out and a change of players and staff as he wants to impose his own style of "management" and "tactics". This is obviously harder to fully achieve if the move is made mid-season, so accompanied by the usual excuses, allowance is initially made my supporters for the first season, as we fans wait for the verdant uplands of the coming of the new season.

Sometimes that new manager gets lucky, sometimes not; Mr Phillips was one of the latter this season. Liam came in to hold the fort, and was not afforded the luxury of bringing in new staff and players, but was extremely successful with what he had. Andy Welsh has now had a reasonable opportunity to make some of the significant changes that he wanted, albeit not all he'd like to make. Some staff have been replaced; players released or marginalised, and new ones brought in. And the end result? The results are going down the pan.

There seemed to be fairly universal agreement at the start of the season that Paul Phillips had assembled a good squad of players, but he couldn't make it work. Liam Tongue, with the same squad of players, did. And Mr Welsh, who initially had the same squad of players as the previous two managers, is not making it work.

Some people have mentioned that Liam Tongue looked a bit despondent yesterday. cdp reckoned "Liam was out of sorts because he could see what we all could - that the approach wasn’t working and tactical changes were needed". guiseleyguile said " Liam didn’t have a good game ( who did !! ) but tactically some of his shouting knew what was going on. But bench didn’t change it". nik thought, " Liam had a stinker but was clearly frustrated that the shape was wrong/people were wrong for the shape."

Maybe that's the answer - perhaps Andy Welsh should be working closer with his club captain and giving greater credence to Liam's tactical insights.

[colin19]

Felt disappointed yesterday that we hadn't seized the initiative - and was grumbling last night. However in the cold light of day I think yesterday was just one misstep.

I thought we did enough at Basford (who themselves are no pushovers and getting results right now), and at Avenue, which was always going to be a tricky game given the local rivalry.

I thought yesterday was a tired looking performance and wondered whether we might have had some sickness in the camp - there seems to be a lot of flu and colds around.

Also I thought Gainsborough looked defensively well drilled, if a little blunt up front. Talking to their supporters it sounded as though they did a similar job on Worksop. Despite the low intensity performance a draw or narrow home win would have been the fairest result.

To that extent I'm not so despondent about the overall direction of travel. I agree that a changing of the guard means that some players will fall out of favour and we will see changes in coming weeks. That also means the addition of quality. Nsaka for example has been generally regarded as a good addition, and a miss in recent matches. Moore and Obasoto need time to settle into the team. I don't necessarily agree with the individual criticism of Denton, who I thought played reasonably well, won a lot of possession and flick-ons. However I agree the forward line lacked a cutting edge and didn't seem to gel. The penalty miss was obviously a key point.

I feel the managers have made themselves very much available. A meet the manager session, always in the bar after the match to my recollection?

However we are very much in contention for the play offs (I think 5th after Marske adjustment). I think our collective disappointment is that things could perhaps be even more positive - which at least makes a refreshing change from how they have been in recent seasons.

We didn't look too good at this stage in 2014 (reached the play off final), were mid-table in 2010 when we won the title so I think there are plenty more highs and lows to come.

[rawdonlion]

Jan 7, 2024 16:51:34 GMT 1 ivor said:

Jan 6, 2024 22:56:11 GMT 1 rawdonlion said:

Didn’t attend the ‘meet the manager’ but in the opening weeks of Welsh appointment it was claimed he involved the community and supporters alike. I don’t really know the guy but not seen any of that myself. Doesn’t engage with fans in the clubhouse from what I’ve seen. I was thinking he might have done more to speak to the fans unless I’ve missed something

I think you have missed something. I have often seen him engage with individual supporters in the bar and he did yesterday. He is entitled also to sit down with his team or family. A manager will always be criticised after poor performances but let's be reasonable

[rawdonlion]

I didn’t say he wasn’t able to sit down with the team and family. What I said was he came with a reputation of meeting the fans. I go in the clubhouse for 1 possibly 2 hours afterwards and I have never spoken to him. That’s my feedback nothing more.

[MrP]

Jan 7, 2024 19:14:11 GMT 1 plasticman said:

The least said about yesterday's seizure of defeat from the jaws of a turgid draw, the better. Some might think the performance on Saturday was one of the worst for years. In my almost complete attendance of home league games over the last 7 years, I've seen worse. A lot worse. In fact I haven't seen very much to cheer about in that time. I think the difference this season is that we'd started to become unaccustomedly a bit spoiled by the overall reasonably good standard since the departure of Paul Phillips at the end of September. Initially we were completely spoiled by the success under the temporary management of Liam Tongue. Since the arrival of Mr Welsh in late September, it's been a bit of a mixed bag at best.

I don't mean to level personal cticisims, but rather to question what "management" means in football. Managers and players alike in the lower leagues are on roundabouts, regularly arriving and departing various destinations, often for very short periods. When a new manager arrives, unlike most other workplaces in life, there is typically a clear out and a change of players and staff as he wants to impose his own style of "management" and "tactics". This is obviously harder to fully achieve if the move is made mid-season, so accompanied by the usual excuses, allowance is initially made my supporters for the first season, as we fans wait for the verdant uplands of the coming of the new season.

Sometimes that new manager gets lucky, sometimes not; Mr Phillips was one of the latter this season. Liam came in to hold the fort, and was not afforded the luxury of bringing in new staff and players, but was extremely successful with what he had. Andy Welsh has now had a reasonable opportunity to make some of the significant changes that he wanted, albeit not all he'd like to make. Some staff have been replaced; players released or marginalised, and new ones brought in. And the end result? The results are going down the pan.

There seemed to be fairly universal agreement at the start of the season that Paul Phillips had assembled a good squad of players, but he couldn't make it work. Liam Tongue, with the same squad of players, did. And Mr Welsh, who initially had the same squad of players as the previous two managers, is not making it work.

Some people have mentioned that Liam Tongue looked a bit despondent yesterday. cdp reckoned "Liam was out of sorts because he could see what we all could - that the approach wasn’t working and tactical changes were needed". guiseleyguile said " Liam didn’t have a good game ( who did !! ) but tactically some of his shouting knew what was going on. But bench didn’t change it". nik thought, " Liam had a stinker but was clearly frustrated that the shape was wrong/people were wrong for the shape."

Maybe that's the answer - perhaps Andy Welsh should be working closer with his club captain and giving greater credence to Liam's tactical insights.

Think Liam has a bright managerial future (when he is ready). He’s a clever bloke, reads the game well and clearly got the best out of the current squad. Liam is close to Tom P and Tom’s marginalisation must be difficult for him. One solution is to re-integrate Tom but we don’t know what is happening in the background between Andy W & Tom. I must admit that I was initially unimpressed with AW and the way he spoke re Liam. I think he talked of beating teams we should and only Marine being a surprise. But I like AW - admittedly PP sets a low bar! Speaking to him in the clubhouse last night, he was hurting big style. He seemed aware of our (Supporters) gripes but he comes across as a genuine guy

[mrsann]

When Liam was temporary manager we got some good results and more importantly played some entertaining football with the mostly young enthusiastic players.
AW may well have been bruised by yesterday's result but it was his chosen team and his game plan.
Can I just point out that in my opinion Mr.Bielsa's downfall at Elland Road was an insistence on doing things his way,playing the team his way with a reluctance to change even when results were going against him.
What do they say doing the same thing over and over when it doesn't work expecting different results there madness lies.

[MrP]

Jan 7, 2024 22:13:22 GMT 1 mrsann said:

When Liam was temporary manager we got some good results and more importantly played some entertaining football with the mostly young enthusiastic players.
AW may well have been bruised by yesterday's result but it was his chosen team and his game plan.
Can I just point out that in my opinion Mr.Bielsa's downfall at Elland Road was an insistence on doing things his way,playing the team his way with a reluctance to change even when results were going against him.
What do they say doing the same thing over and over when it doesn't work expecting different results there madness lies.

I think I understand what you are saying but AW has been in place for (Query) 2 months, we surely can’t be judging him yet?!? And as PlasticMan rightly said we’ve sent much worse than G’boro over many years. PlasticMan is right to remind us that we are judging recent performances vs that seen under Liam and then AW. Perhaps we should remember just how bad we were under PC or PP last season

[Nik]

I’ve seen at least a hundred more turgid performances than yesterday in my time, it was incredibly disappointing after recent times and I came home totally dispirited but let’s get real, it still had moments of excitement and (for the purist) good defensive teamwork. We’ve gone through whole months with less action than we’ve seen this week.